'Baliol1'
Index links to: Lead / Letter
Families covered: Baliol of Barnard Castle, Baliol of Bywell, Baliol of Cavers, Baliol of Scotland, Baillie of Hoprig
[This page was originally uploaded as 'Baillie1'. The name was changed to 'Baliol1' on 22.12.2003. See note (2) below.]
| (1) TCP reports that "The locality from which this family derived was generally presumed to be in Normandy until it was shown by J.H. Round ... that the family was of Picard origin, and sprang from Bailleul in the modern department of Somme." (2) This page was reviewed when this page was moved here in 2003 but the result was not fully satisfactory so we headed the page with the note that "The sources we have found for this family support and contradict each other as shown below" and provided notes to highlight the main discrepancies. At that time the Main Sources we were using were BE1883 & 'Lives of the Baillies' (both still mentioned below in Main Sources) and http://jarnou.free.fr/debailleul.html. A check on 03.05.15 found that the jarnou site could no longer be found. That was still the case on 11.05.19 when this page was redone completely without any reference to that jarnou site. That review in May 2019 was based on Hodgson's work which was issued in 1902, after most of the other sources referred to below. |
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| Guy de Baliol | |||||||||||||||
| Hodgson, whose interest in this family appears mainly to be in following the barony of Bywell, starts with this Guy (with no added information, just identifying him as 'Guy de Baliol'), showing him as father of Hugh, Guy, Joscelin & Hawis. Baillie, Banks and various other sources identify Guy de Baliol (temp William Rufus who r. 1087-1100) as father of Bernard/Barnard who m. Agnes de Pincheni. BE1883 reports that that Barnard was the successor of the Guy (Guido or Wido) who obtained Biwell but points out that "some accounts" show him as son of an earlier Barnard. As shown below, Hodgson shows Barnard as grandson of the following Hugh and grand-nephew of the Guy who was the first to obtain Bywell temp William Rufus. | |||||||||||||||
| 1. | Hugh de Baliol, Sire de Bailleul-en-Vimeu (a 1130) this generation shown by Hodgson but not by most other sources | ||||||||||||||
| A. | Bernard or Barnard de Baliol, Sire de Bailleul-en-Vimeu et Helicourt (d before 1167) | ||||||||||||||
| m. Matilda | |||||||||||||||
| i. | Barnard de Baliol of Bywell (Northumberland) & Barnard Castle (c. Durham) (d before 1193) | ||||||||||||||
| m. Agnes de Picquigny or Pincheni | |||||||||||||||
| a. | Eustace Baliol of Bywell & Barnard Castle (d c1200) | ||||||||||||||
| Various sources show Eustace as father of Hugh by Petronell. However, Hodgson shows him (and his siblings) as son of an earlier unnamed wife. | |||||||||||||||
| m1. ?? | |||||||||||||||
| (1) | Hugh Baliol of Bywell & Barnard Castle (d 1228) | ||||||||||||||
| m. Cecily de Fontaines (dau of Aleaume Fontaine) | |||||||||||||||
| (A) | John Baliol of Bywell & Barnard Castle (d c10.1268) | ||||||||||||||
| m. (1233) Devorgilla of Galloway (d 28.01.1289/690, dau/heir of Alan, Lord of Galloway, by Margaret, dau/coheir of David, Earl of Huntingdon) | |||||||||||||||
| Devorgilla was a great-niece of the Scots Kings Malcolm IV and William 'the Lion'. It was because of this connection that her son John became entitled to claim the throne. | |||||||||||||||
| (i) | Sir Hugh Baliol -of Bywell & Barnard Castle (b c1240, dsp c1271) | ||||||||||||||
| m. Agnes de Valentia (d c1308, dau of William de Valentia, Earl of Pembroke, niec of Henry III, widow of Maurice Fitzgerald, m3. John de Avesnes of Beaumont) | |||||||||||||||
| (ii) | Alexander Baliol of Bywell & Barnard Castle (dsp 1278, 3rd son) | ||||||||||||||
| m. Eleanor de Genoure (a 1306, m2. Robert de Stuteville) | |||||||||||||||
| Baillie suggests that Alexander's successor his son John but most other sources identify John as his brother. | |||||||||||||||
| (iii) | John Baliol of Byewell & Barnard Castle, Lord of Galloway, King of Scots (b c1240, d 1313-4) | ||||||||||||||
| TCP ('Balliol or Baliol') supports the following. | |||||||||||||||
| m. (before 02.1280/91) Isabel de Warenne (dau of John Plantagenet de Warenne, 7th Earl of Surrey) | |||||||||||||||
| (a) | Edward Baliol, King of Scots (b 1282, dsp 1353) | ||||||||||||||
| Hodgson reports that Edward m. Margaret, princess of Tarentum (who m2. Francis, duke of Andria. TCP | |||||||||||||||
| (b)+ | other issue - Henry (b c1284/5, dsp 16.12.1332), Margaret (or Agnes or Maud) (b c1282, d unm), Anne (b c1286) | ||||||||||||||
| There is some confusion as to the identity of King John's daughters. Hodgson mentions none of them. Various sources identify 2 daughters but they are named differently, albeit normally Margaret and Anne. Various sources (including 'RoyalData' and GenEU) suggest that the younger daughter married Brian FitzAlan of Bedale but TCP ('FitzAlan') makes no such suggestion whilst, as mentioned below, TCP ('Balliol or Baliol') refers to such a daughter being erroneously mentioned for a generation earlier. | |||||||||||||||
| (iv) | Margaret Baliol of Gillesland (dsp) TCP suggests that Margaret d unm but Hodgson & Banks (Baronies) suggests that she married ... | ||||||||||||||
| m. _ Multon | |||||||||||||||
| (v) | Ada Baliol | GS | |||||||||||||
| m. William (or Walter) Lindsay of Lamberton | GS | ||||||||||||||
| (vi) | Cecily Baliol | ||||||||||||||
| m. John de Burgh (grandson of Hubert, Earl of Kent) | |||||||||||||||
| (vii) | Mary or Alianora de Baliol named Mary by Hodgson, BE1883 & TCP (Balliol) but as Alianore by TSP (Badenoch) | ||||||||||||||
| m. John Comyn of Badenoch | |||||||||||||||
| (viii)+ | other issue - Alan (dsp), Henry (d 16.12.1332) | ||||||||||||||
| TCP reports that some sources suggest that there was another daughter in this generation, Anne who m. Brian FitzAlan of Bedale, but notes that this was "in error". | |||||||||||||||
| (B) | Eustace Baliol (d 1272) ## probable dupication below ## | ||||||||||||||
| m. Hawise Levynton (dau/heir of Ralph Levynton of Northumberland) | |||||||||||||||
| Hodgson reports that Eustace's wife was "also called dau of Ada, who was the wife of William de Furneval". | |||||||||||||||
| (C) | Ada Baliol (d 29.07.1251) | ||||||||||||||
| m. John FitzRobert de Warkworth | |||||||||||||||
| (D)+ | other issue - Hugh of Helicourt (a 1282), Ingelgram (a 10.1270), Joscelin (a 1255), Bernard (priest of Gainford) | ||||||||||||||
| (2)+ | other issue - Ingelgram, Bernard (a 1245), Henry | ||||||||||||||
| m2. (c1190) Petronell (widow of Robert Fitzpiers) | |||||||||||||||
| b. | Sir Henry Baliol of Cavers (co. Roxburgh), 'Chamberlain of Scotland' | ||||||||||||||
| Hodgson shows that Henry m. Laura de Valoignes but does not follow his line. She is described in Banks (Baronage) as "one of the coheirs to Christian, wife of William de Mandeveille, earl of Essex" but by Baillie as coheir of Christian, wife of William de Marchville, Earl of Essex. TCP ('Balliol or Baliol (of Cavers)') supports the following, identifying Lora as follows. Note that Valoignes and Valoniis appear to be used interchangeably. | |||||||||||||||
| m. Lora de Valoignes (dau of William de Valoignes, Chamberlain of Scotland) | |||||||||||||||
| (1) | Guy de Baliol (d Evesham 1265) | ||||||||||||||
| (2) | Sir Alexander de Baliol of Cavers (and Chilham), Chamberlain of Scotland (d before 06.1311) | ||||||||||||||
| TCP ('Balliol or Baliol (of Cavers)') supports the view, reported in 'The Genealogist' (vol 6, 1882, p1+), that the common notion that this Alexander was a younger brother of King John Baliol is erroneous. TCP reports that he was summoned "to attend the King at Shrewsbury" in June 1283 (by Edward I) which is presumably the reason why he was identified as a Lord. However, this title is not mentioned by our other sources and presumably was not supported after the rejection of King Edward's attempt to control Scotland. | |||||||||||||||
| m. (c1270) Isabel de Chilham (b after 1245, d before 01.05.1292, dau of Richard de Dover of Chilham) | |||||||||||||||
| (A) | Sir Thomas Balliol (Baliol) of Cavers | ||||||||||||||
| TCP reports that Sir Alexander was succeeded by his son Thomas (a 07. 02.1312/3) who "soon disappears from record". We used to show Sir Thomas as "possibly father or grandfather of" another Sir Thomas of Cavers (no further information) plus Isabel (m. Ranald More) but cannot find the source for that information, which we presume was the jarnou site mentioned at the top of the page | |||||||||||||||
| The only child of Alexander & Isabel shown by Baillie & Scott (see the note under William 'le Scot' just below) is ... | |||||||||||||||
| (B) | Alexander Baliol of Cavers | ||||||||||||||
| Baillie does not identify Alexander's wife but Scot suggests that she was Isabel, dau of Sir John Stewart of Bonkil & relict of Thoams Randolph, Earl of Mar & Regent of Scotland (by whom she was mother of Thomas, Earl of Mar). That Isabel appears to be confusion between the wife (dau of Sir John of Bonkil) of Thomas Randolph, 1st Earl of Moray (d 1332), and the wife (dau of Sir John's son Sir Alexander of Bonkil) who was probably the wife of Donald, Earl of Mar (d 1332). Provisionally, we show this Alexander's wife as ... | |||||||||||||||
| m. Isabel Stewart (dau of Sir John Stewart of Bonkil, relict of Thomas Randolph, 1st Earl of Moray) | |||||||||||||||
| Baillie reports tbe view, without giving it full support, that Sir Alexander may have had 2 sons other than Alexander: John & William though William may have been son rather than brother of John. Baillie then reports William's family as shown below. | |||||||||||||||
| (C) | Sir John Baillie of Hoprig, East Lothian possibly named Sir Henry in the jarnou site mentioned at the top of the page | ||||||||||||||
| (D) | William Baillie of Hoprig | ||||||||||||||
| m. ?? Wallace, heiress of Lamington (dau of Sir William Wallace, the patriot) | |||||||||||||||
| (i) | Sir William Baillie of Hoprig & Lamington (a 1357) | -- | |||||||||||||
| m. Isabella Seton (dau of Sir William Seton of Seton) | -- | ||||||||||||||
| (3) | William de Baliol 'le Scot' (b c1251, d c1313, Chamberlain of Scotland) | ||||||||||||||
| William is not mentioned by TCP though, as a younger brother of the subject to TCP's article, that is not unusual. 'Memorials of the Family of Scott, of Scot's Hall, in the County of Kent' (James Renat Scott, 1876) shows William as brother of the Alexander who m. Isabel de Chilham, which appears not to be disputed, but then in consequence, along with some other sources such as Burke's 'The Patrician' (vol 3, 1847, p265), erroneously show Alexander & William as brothers rather than cousins of King John. | |||||||||||||||
| c. | Eustace de Baliol, Sheriff of Cumberland, Governor of Carlise ## shown here by BE18883, probable duplication above ## | ||||||||||||||
| m. Hawise de Boyville (dau of Ralph de Boyville de Levyngton) | |||||||||||||||
| d. | Enor Baliol | ||||||||||||||
| m. Hugh de Fontaines | |||||||||||||||
| e.+ | other issue - Bernard (a 1212), Enguarran (a 1215) | ||||||||||||||
| Reportedly descended from this family, but how is not known, was the undermentioned Sir Robert, mentioned in Visitation (Foster 1875, Yorkshire, 1584/5, 'Burdett of Denby'). | |||||||||||||||
| (1) | ?? Baliol presumed intermediary generation | ||||||||||||||
| (A) | Sir Robert Baliol | ||||||||||||||
| m. Margaret Denby (dau/heir of Sir Robert de Denby by Margaret, dau/heir of Sir Robert de Holand) | |||||||||||||||
| (i) | Idonea Baliol, heiress of Denby & Nether Holland | ||||||||||||||
| m. Robert Burdett (a 1303) | |||||||||||||||
| ii.+ | other issue - Ingelgram (a 1153), Guy (a 1152), Eustace, Amidis, Hawise | ||||||||||||||
| B.+ | other issue - Eustace (d before 1138?), Ralph, Joscelin, Guy, Hugh | ||||||||||||||
| 2. | Guy de Baliol of Bywell (a temp William Rufus who r. 1087-1100) | ||||||||||||||
| m. Dionisia | |||||||||||||||
| A. | Hawise de Baliol shown by Banks as daughter of Wido (Guy) & sister of the Bernard who was father of the Bernard who m. Agnes Pincheni | ||||||||||||||
| m. William Bertram of Mitford | |||||||||||||||
| 3. | Joscelin de Baliol | ||||||||||||||
| A. | Ingelgram de Baliol | ||||||||||||||
| m. ?? de Berkeley (dau of Sir Walter de Berkeley, Chamberlain) wife of this Ingelgram?, presumed mother of ... | |||||||||||||||
| i. | Eustace de Baliol | ||||||||||||||
| m. Agnes Percy | |||||||||||||||
| a. | Ingelgram de Baliol of Tours (dsp 1299) | ||||||||||||||
| ii. | Agnes or Ellen de Baliol (d c1281) | Y | |||||||||||||
| m. William Percy | Y | ||||||||||||||
| 4. | Hawise de Baliol | ||||||||||||||
Main source(s):
(1) 'A History of Northumberland' (vol 6, John Crawford Hodgson, 1902, 'Baliol of Bailleul-en-Vimeu, Bywell and Barnard Castle', p72+)
(2) Various sources considered but, except as mentioned above, not always followed include BE1883 ('Baliol'), 'Lives of the Baillies' (James William Baillie, 1872), TCP ('Balliol or Baliol'), 'The Patrician' (Burke, vol 3, 1847, p174), 'Baronies in Fee' (Banks, vol 1, 1844, p114), 'Dormant and Extinct Baronage of England' (Banks, vol 1, 1807, 'Baliol', p19+)
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