|Families covered by the page:||Bryan of Cheddington, Bryan in Claire, Bryan (or Brian) of Laugharne Castle, Bryan (or Brian) of Tor Brian, Bryan (or Brian or Brien) of Walwyn's Castle|
|Latest ('proper') version of the page:||Bryan1|
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The following shows (de-formatted) most of the data contained in the 'proper' version of this page as it was in early 2012. It is shown here to help search engines find our data as some search engines appear to have difficulty finding the data within our 'proper' database pages. Since ours is a dynamic ever-improving site which changes almost every day, it is possible that the 'proper page' has been changed since this 'redirect page' was created.
'Bryan1' Families covered: Bryan of Cheddington, Bryan in Claire, Bryan (or Brian) of Laugharne Castle, Bryan (or Brian) of Tor Brian, Bryan (or Brian or Brien) of Walwyn's Castlebr font [Much of the top part of this page was originally uploaded as 'BZmisc06' on 06.11.03. It was moved here to facilitate expansion.] There are doubts concerning the early generations of this family. There were several successive heads of the family called Guy. Some web sites show just 5 generations, with the first being Guy 'Adomarus' (a 1219). Some of those sites show him to be a son of ....continentbbbrienne1.link6 target_selfAlphonse de Brienne, Count d'Eua, but no evidence to support this has been seen. Not least because TCP (Bryan) identifies the father of Lord Bryan as of Tor Brian, Devon, we provisionally follow those sites (including some providing advice about Laugharne Castle) and, according to a site visitor (CH, 11.04.04) who kindly brought this to our attention, a guide book about Laugharne Castle, which report that there were 7 successive Guy de Brians with the first being ... td 16 2linkhiaGuy de Brian or Bryan of Torbryan or Tor Brian (a mid-12th century) (I) 21. td 15 2Guy de Brian or Bryan (II) td 15 2 The first mentioned by many sites is the following Guy who is reported as having first appeared in South Wales in about 1219. 2A. td 14 2Guy de Brian or Bryan ('Adomarus') (b c1202) (III) td 2 td 14 2..pppole03.linkhim. Jane de la Polea font named in some web sites td 2 2i. td 13 2Guy de Brian or Bryan of Walwyn's Castle (b 1228, d c1268) (IV) td 3 td 13 2 BE1883, which starts with this Guy, clearly reports that he had 2 wives, Eve (mother of Maud only) and the unidentified mother of the next Guy. On the grounds that, for these early years, information about a widow is often more clearly recorded than information about earlier wives, we presume that Eve was Guy's second wife. td 3 td 13 2m1. td 3 15lkhi idlkhia td 15 2a. td 12 15 2Sir Guy de Brian of Walwyn's Castle, Laugharne Castle, and Tor Brian (b c1254, d 1307) (V) td 4 td 12 2m. Sibil de Sully (dau of Walter de Sully) font named in some web sites td 4 2(1) td 11 2Sir Guy de Brian or Brien of Walwyn's Castle, Laugharne Castle, and Tor Brian (d by 1349) (VI) td 5link1a td 11 2 There is some confusion as to the identity of the wives of this and the next Guy. TCP (FitzPayn) reports that the first wife of Lord Briene was Joan, da. (it is said) of Sir John de Carreu, of Carew but TCP (Bryan) reports that Lord Briene appears to have [married] .... Ann, or Alice, da.and h. of William Holway ....., but she possibly was his father's wife. As TCP (Bryan) reports that a Guy de Brian ... and Alice his wife, were living 27 Jan 13434 and as Lord Briene is known to have married his second wife by July 1350, we suspect that AnnAlice Holway was second wife of this Guy. Various web sites identify his 1st wife as Wenthlian (dau of Sir Griffith Lloyd of Anglesea) but, provisionally (!), we presume that she was Sir Griffith's daughter who, according to Griffith's Pedigrees, was named ... td 5 td 11 2..wwwales53.lklom1. Krisli (Cicely) Lloyd (dau of Sir Griffith Lloyd of Tregarnedd & Dinorwic)a td 5 2(A) td 10 2Guy de Brian or Briene or Bryan, Lord Bryan or Briene (d 17.08.1390) (VII) td 6 td 10 2 As mentioned above, TCP (FitzPayn) identifies Lord Briene's first wife and mother of Elizabeth as Joan (Carrew) but, strangely, she is not mentioned in TCP (Bryan). Many web sites suggest that Elizabeth's mother was Anne Holway but, as reported above, we suspect that she was this Guy's step-mother. td 6 td 10 2..cc4aqcarew01.con1 target_selfm1. Joan Carew (probably dau of Sir John Carew of Carew)a td 6 2(i) td 9 2Elizabeth de Brien td 7 td 9 2..gggrey01.link2 target_selfm. (before 10.1354) Robert de Grey, later FitzPayn of Cherlton-Grey (d 21.05.1393)a td 6 td 10 2..mm4fzmontacute1.link3 target_selfm2. (before 10.07.1350) Elizabeth Montacute (d 31.05.1359, dau of William Montacute, 1st Earl of Salisbury)a td 6dau1a 2(ii) td 9 2Sir Guy de Briene (dvp 1386) td 7 td 9 2m. Alice de Bures (a 01.1393, dau of Sir Roibert de Bures of Bures St. Mary) td 7 2(a) td 8 2Philippe or Alice de Briene (b c1378, dsp 14078) td 8 td 8 2m1. John Devereux, 2nd Lord (or John de Ros) td 8 td 8 2m2. Sir Henry le Scrope td 7 2(b) td 8 2Elizabeth de Briene (b c1380) td 8 td 8 2..lllovel02.dau1 target_selfm. Sir Robert Lovela td 6 2(iii) td 9 2Sir William de Briene (dsp 22.09.1395) td 7 td 9 2m. Joan td 7 td 9 2 TCP and BE1883 both report that, apart from Guy who dvp, the sons of Lord Bryan died without issue. However, several web sites show this William as father, by Joan FitzAlan, of Thomas Bryan (con1see belowa), ancestor of the Bryans of Cheddington. As some of those web sites give dates for that Thomas's father as 1349-1413, and noting that TCP reports that the above William died in 1395, it is suggested that those web sites have identified the wrong William. td 6 2(iv) td 9 2Philip de Briene (dsp before 14.02.1388) td 6 2(v) td 9 2Margaret de Briene td 7 td 9 2m. Hugh de Courtenay (dsp 20.02.13734) td 6 2(vi) td 9 2Philippe de Briene (a 10.1406) td 7 td 9 2m1. Edward Bohun (dvpsp 01.13612, of Midhurst family) td 7 td 9 2m2. Sir John Chandos of Snodhill, 3rd Lord (dsp 16.12.1428) td 7linkloa td 9 2 BE1883 (Bryan) shows two Philippes: one, aunt of this one, being the one who married Sir John Chandos. However, TCP (Chaundos) reports that Philippe, daughter of Lord Briene, was widow of Edward Bohun when she married John Chandos. td 5 td 11 2 m2. (before 13434) Ann or Alice Holway (a 13434, dau of William Holway of Holway) td 3 2b. td 12 2Ela de Briene or Bryan (d 16.02.13556) td 4 td 12 2 This connection is not fully secure. It is thought that Sir Guy had a daughter by his first wife but her identity is unclear. TCP, in its articles on Marshal and FitzPayne, suggests that the parentage of their wife Ela was not known. BE1883 (Marshal) does not name John Marshal's wife but BE1883 FitzPayne) shows Ela as daughter and co-heir of Guy de Bryan. The dates suggest that she was of this or the next generation. td 4 td 12 2..mm4aemarshal01.linklo target_selfm1. John Marshal, 2nd Lord (b 01.08.1292, dsp 12.08.1316)a td 4 td 12 2..fffzmisc01.payn1 target_selfm2. Robert FitzPayn, 2nd Lord (d 30.11.1354)a td 3 td 13 2..tttracy1.barnst1 target_selfm2. Eve (dau of Henry de Traci of Barnstaple)a td 3 2c. td 12 2Maud de Briene (d 1279) td 4 td 12 2..mm4aemartin02.link1 target_selfm1. Nicholas Martin of Kemes (b c1236, dvp c1260)a td 4 td 12 2..cc4rzczmisc09.link1 target_selfm2. Geoffrey de Canville or Camville, 1st Lord (d before 21.09.1308)a td 16 2con1a td 16 p p p p td 16 2Thomas Bryan of Cheddington (b 1358, d 1444) td 16 2 Various web sites show Thomas as son of William Bryan, son of Guy, Lord Bryan, but we doubt that he was because:br (1) some of them, which show Thomas's dates as above, show that William's dates as 1349-1444, suggesting that William fathered Thomas when he was 8 years old.link2abr (2) as mentioned dau1abovea, we doubt that that William was son of Lord Bryan. td 16 2m. Margaret Echyngham 21. td 15 2Edmund Bryan of Cheddington (b 1412) td 15 2m. Alice Bures 2A. td 14 2Thomas Bryan of Cheddington (b 1438, d 1500, chief justice) td 2 td 14 2m. (1463) Margaret Bowsey td 2 2i. td 13 2Sir Thomas Bryan of Cheddington and Ashridge (b 1464, d 1517) td 3 td 13 2bourchier1.linklo2 target_selfm. Margaret Bourchier (d 1468, d 1551, dau of Sir Humphrey Bourchier)a td 3 2a. td 12 2Sir Francis Bryan (d 02.02.154950, Lord Chief Justice of Ireland) td 4 td 12 2..fffitzthomas1.link1 target_selfm. (1548) Joan Fitzgerald (dau of James FitzThomas or Fitzgerald, 10th Earl of Desmond)a td 4 2(1) td 11 2Sir Francis Bryan in Claire (b 1549) td 5 td 11 2m. Ann Smith (dau of William Smith) td 5da1a 2(A) td 10 2William Smith Bryan in Claire (d 1667, to Virginia, USA) td 6 td 10 2m. Catherine Morgan td 6 2(i) td 9 2Francis Bryan (b 1630, d 16934, to Ireland) td 7 td 9 2m. Sarah Brinker (from Denmark) td 7 2(a) td 8 2William Bryan (b 1685, d 1789, to Virginia, USA) font had issue td 8 td 8 2m. Margaret td 7 2(b) td 8 2Morgan Bryan (to Virginia, USA) font had issue td 8 td 8 2m. Martha Strode td 7 2(c) td 8 2Cornelius Bryan (b 16934, d 1751, to Virginia, USA) font had issue td 8 td 8 2m. Rebecca td 2 2ii. td 13 2Elizabeth Bryan font identified by a site visitor (DS, 21.07.07) as of this family, of this generation td 3 td 13 2..cc4aqcarew01.bedd1m. Sir Nicholas Carew of Beddingtona table p 2(s):br (1) For upper section : TCP (Bryan), BE1883 (Bryan).br (2) For lower section : various web sites.br p